Fabian Geyrhalter:
Welcome to the show, Jahi.

Jahi Sundance:
Hey, what's up, man? It's good to be here. I'm glad to be on.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Oh, it's so good to have you here. Just for everyone listening, you are a multi-instrumentalist, you're a producer, you're a songwriter, you're a DJ. I don't know what you're not when it comes to music, but you're all of that. You have toured with everyone from Mos Def to Talib Kwali and you graced the stages of Carnegie Hall and Lincoln Center. You're producing, your songwriting, your credits include Chris Brown, Miguel, Common. I personally got the experience to hear and see your work last Sunday. No, it was two Sundays ago at The Blue Note in Los Angeles where you guys played an insane show. It was with Robert Glasper.
During that show, I learned how you use your turntable as an instrument, as a jazz instrument. And I believe you credit the wonderful Meshell Ndegeocello. You got to say that 10 times in a row, Meshell Ndegeocello, for giving you that stage back in the day, that purpose of becoming a DJ in a band, fully integrated as an instrument, being almost inseparable and foundational to the goal of the music that is being co-created on the stage. How did that come about with you becoming part of a band? And is that true that it was Meshell that took you under her wings in the beginning?

Jahi Sundance:
So yeah, basically how it happened was I was DJing about four or five nights a week in Manhattan at clubs, and I had a gig at the Chelsea Hotel. Meshell was staying there, so she came down to the basement to, I guess, have a meeting or a drink or something, and I was DJing down there at the bar and she loved my set and she was playing that weekend at a club in New York and was like, "Why don't you come down to the club and be the opening act for the weekend because you had such a good set and I don't have an opener." And I was like, "Oh, sounds great." So that's how I linked up with her
And I started opening and then she asked me to go on tour with her and open. And while we were on the road, I actually read an article about Gang Starr and Primo is in the article talking about how when he first moved from Texas up to the Boston area and linked up with Guru, that he wasn't even making beats. He was just DJing and Guru was rapping and then he realized that he had to contribute more. He had to make beats in order to really be as equally as creative as Guru in the group. Because at that moment, what he would be doing is spinning other people's instrumentals while Guru would be rapping on top, but Guru's rapping his own raps and Premier is spinning other people's instrumentals. So he realized, no, no, these need to be my beats. And so as I read this article,
I'm on the road with Meshell being an opener. And so I looked at her and I said, "I don't know what I'm going to do, but I would love it if you let me stay on stage after I open and then I could try some stuff." And she was a person who was so wide open and so musically creative and ready for risk taking that she allowed me to do that, which was crazy too because it was a lot of experimenting and a lot of mistakes on that road and I didn't do those experiments or mistakes at rehearsal. I did them on the tour during the shows. So shout out to her for being so courageous and allowing me the space on stage to develop this style that I've come up with for performance with bands, this DJing style that I've invented for band performance was all kind of done in her group because she allowed me the space.
So shout out to her. I always love her. That's my family. She's the best.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
I'm a big fan of hers since a mighty long time. I actually caught her in New York Life the last time I was there and it's always magnificent. She's amazing. But it's such a story with Gang Starr and how literally on the way to the show. I mean, it's just amazing and all that risk taken that you took and she took. I mean, both of you did, right?

Jahi Sundance:
Yeah.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
The show that I saw two weeks ago, and I told you this before, I think in an email when I made my introduction to you, but when you blended Dolly Parton's 'Jolene', which of course was a huge hit for everyone in the audience at this point, but you blended it with a Sade track, I believe. And it was such a highlight of the entire show. And for anyone listening, they're like, wait, how is it even possible? How is that a highlight of a Robert Glasper show? But I though to myself in that moment, I got to get this man onto my podcast and we got to chat about all things records. Funny enough, I talked to a friend of mine who also saw you guys, but weeks ago, maybe five, six weeks ago, and he immediately, the one thing that he mentioned about the show was that exact specific part with Jolene.
But you majorly adjusted the songs. I mean, they almost became their own tracks and you made them blend so effortlessly that it was like this mind fuck where you're like, is it one? Is it another? What's going on? Holy smokes, this is Sade. What's the trick? I mean, open up your bag of tricks. How do you create a sequence like that?

Jahi Sundance:
Well, just to tell the actual story of it, the day that Dolly died, we had a gig just outside of Washington DC. And for soundcheck, everybody was in the back and I went out first for soundcheck and had opened up Jolene and a few other Dolly tracks and was just making quick loops and just kind of playing around with a loop when everybody walked in. And when everybody sits down at Soundcheck, if I'm playing something, they'll just kind of play along to what I'm playing to start the soundcheck. And so everybody started playing along to Jolene and then I started doing it and then I'm realizing that that was only a half step away from Cherish the Day and also from Afro Blue and also from a bunch of other records like Gypsy Woman and a bunch of other records that are all within a half step of this key of Jolene. And so we just started freestyling a little bit and then put those together at the soundcheck. And then Rob was like, "Oh, we're doing this tonight." And we've been doing it pretty much every show since she passed away. And it was really just started because she lived such an inspirational life and she was loved by so many people that it was like, oh, we have to put something in the show for her because that's how that started, that's how that went.
And the musicality of it is being able to realize, oh, I have all these other songs and the keys are really close. All I have to do is adjust them just a little bit and we can get to going. And the next part of it is fitting everything together rhythmically, which takes a lot of imagination because all of these tunes have to be re... Well, Jolene doesn't have to be redone, refit because it's kind of the central tune. So we're using the BPM of that tune or we're in the neighborhood of the BPM of that tune and then I have to adjust everything else. So something like Cherish The Day is more like 91 BPM and I have to figure out how to fit it into 110 BPM scheme, which means I have to separate those lines and place them on beat so that they feel natural and rhythmically re-approach the way the song is delivered in its original format so that it will fit the new BPM that it's on.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
And that's what the magic is. And for anyone who doesn't think in beats per minute, but thinks like a regular consumer of music, it was just completely effortless.

Jahi Sundance:
Fitting a slow song onto a very fast song.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Sure, exactly. Exactly. And that's what the genius was because Cherish the Day is not a fast song. And then suddenly you hear the lyrics and you're like, "Damn, I know that. Damn, it's Sade." It's like, "Oh my God, it's a slow song."
And I mean, at least in LA, I mean, everyone was up and dancing and there were so many different facets and vibes through the show. And I love that some of them are created almost by the response by the audience, but it's also within... I mean, it's jazz, right? You don't know what's going to happen the next minute. A lot of things you do know, but some things you don't. And I mean, that's the magic of what you do. I read an interview with you from five years back and you said the following. I'm going to quote you now. Get ready.

Jahi Sundance:
Let's see what I said. Let's see what I said...

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Yeah, exactly. Let's see what I was up to five years ago. You said, "What I'm really trying to do with DJing is be like a record, be like a circle around the entire band. So I'm trying to affect and respond to everybody's playing an entire band in subtle ways, not all at once, but still encircling the whole band. I'm trying to be a circle around everybody. No matter which shape they may be in, whether they're a triangle or square or a circle themselves, I'm always trying to be a circle." I think that's so great. I mean, this still feels good to you.

Jahi Sundance:
Shout out to Anthony Braxton who taught me about the house of the triangle and the house of the square and the house of the circle. And that's kind of what that applies to. I don't know if you're familiar with Anthony Braxton. He's one of the legends of the avant-garde jazz world. He's a MacArthur genius and all that kind of stuff. He's older now, but those three concepts are very foundational to my philosophy in music and how I get down. And so yeah, I still believe that. And even more, that feeling of wanting to be a circle around the band really is exactly what I'm still doing. And I think it'll be what I'm always doing when I'm on stage as far as how I will approach DJing will always be in that way when it comes to DJing with a band because what I'm providing is not necessarily what Rob and the different people who run these bands have provided me with is not necessarily a space to showcase my skills.
My purpose is rather to create emotional context around the entirety of the instrumental space so that that way there's some sort of layer that wasn't there before that communicates in a way that sometimes musical instruments cannot or enhances the ways that those musical instruments are communicating. And that's really what's important to me as a DJ in that format is definitely being a circle for sure. Yeah, that's it. I remember that interview and I remember seeing it.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
And it sounds almost esoteric and it sounds very... It's hard for people to put that idea behind triangle square and circle until they see it all come together. And now that I have seen you perform as part of the circles and triangles and squares, you being the circle around to hone it in and bring it in, and it's a little bit like a conductor. It's just that in jazz there's not one conductor, there's three conductors or four conductors, but it's like everyone's role to hone in the orchestra and get the best out of them. I've seen you do it, and I think for anyone listening who hasn't seen you or Rob and all of you guys together, I think you're going to be at Blue Note the whole month of October in New York.

Jahi Sundance:
Yeah, we'll be in New York for all of October, and then we'll be in London in November. And then in December, we're also throughout the West Coast. So yeah, we'll be in Seattle, Portland, San Francisco, and LA in December. Stay on the lookout. Lots of shows coming up. Always shows. This band never stops working. We're always looking.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
It's great. It's cool. And now that we talk about circles already, let's jump into the record part of this conversation, which I'm always very excited about. Do you remember the first record you bought? Absolutely. Do you know what it was?

Jahi Sundance:
I sure do. It was a 12... Not a 12 inch. It was a 45 of Run's House, Run - DMC, The other side had Beats to the Rhyme on it. And I bought it at a corner store of my block called Farmer in the Dell. So this store is still there. It's like a bodega, like a corner store on my block in Brooklyn. I grew up in Brooklyn. I was like five or six years old, and it was my own money. And this was back in the day. You could tell how old I am now. I'm telling on myself.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
We don't talk about this because otherwise you ask me too, and we don't want to talk about this.

Jahi Sundance:
This is when they used to sell 45s at, for those listening, it would be like seeing a rack of 45s at the 7-Eleven next to the counter. That's what it would be like. So they used to sell 45s at basically every tiny bodega used to sell 45s in New York, and they would have a rack of them, and it had Run - DMC on there, like I said, Run's House Beast of Rhyme or something like that. But it was definitely a Run - DMC 45 on it. I might be getting the B side wrong, but the A side was definitely Run's House. And then I bought that and took it home and popped it on my little Fisher-Price turntable. I know a lot of people remember that. It was tan and cream, and it had a big brown tone arm on it that was super thick. That was such a great kid's turntable.
It was amazing.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
A complete and other piece of crap that you loved more than anything you ever loved when it comes to

Jahi Sundance:
A piece of equipment. So durable. So durable. It was a real toy. That toy fell down the stairs and still played records afterwards. You know what I mean? That was a real toy. What the good old days. Unbelievable.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
That was the first record

Jahi Sundance:
I ever bought.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
You asked me before we got on air where I'm from, and in Vienna and Austria, we did not have that. I mean, we did not have seven inches 45s at grocery stores or anything like that. I mean, it was in department stores in the record section. But the one thing that we share is that I was about the same age when I bought my first record, and it was the same idea that it had to be a seven inch because the less expensive is the only thing I could possibly buy. Yeah, it's what you can afford. Two songs.

Jahi Sundance:
It was like $1, you know what I mean? It was like 99 cents or maybe it was $1.50 or something. It was totally affordable.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Yeah, I remember that. Amazing. How much of your musical taste, and those who know your upbringing a little bit, most probably already know the answer to that, but how much of your musical taste do you attribute to your upbringing? I mean, your father is the renowned avant-garde chazz saxophonist, Oliver Lake. I have a feeling it had something to do with your musical taste. 

Jahi Sundance:
Mean, yeah. When we were young, my dad would play a lot of records at dinner, and then also I was a backstage kid, so I was backstage at the Blue Note, you know

Fabian Geyrhalter:
What I mean? Amazing.

Jahi Sundance:
In 1984 when I was five, when I bought that Run - DMC record. So it's kind of the same deal. I was a backstage baby, so I kind of grew up in the environment of jazz and jazz shows. So obviously that is the direct link of my musical heritage and where it comes from. And it all comes from there. It's passed

Fabian Geyrhalter:
…down. Usually kids like to rebel and revolt, and if there's a lot of jazz at the dinner table, then maybe at some point you don't want jazz. Or was there something where you felt like...

Jahi Sundance:
I got so lucky, man. I got so lucky because I'm 13 in 1992. So that means for me to rebel and revolt, I didn't have to do much. Rap was right there, and it was the best years of it. And I didn't have to do anything to jump into it. It was right there just waiting for me. And it was literally the best years of rap. So I got to jump into the rap thing and I didn't get any friction because my dad was like, "Oh yeah, I know that sample." You know what I'm saying? It was no friction at all. My parents were just like, "Oh yeah, we like rap. It's cool." You know what I mean?

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Amazing.

Jahi Sundance:
So the rebel part didn't really happen because I don't think there was any music really, unless I just decided to like Greatest Hits of the KKK, I don't think there's any music that my parents would've been like, "Oh no, you can't do this." That wasn't the case at all. Yeah, like I said, it would have to be something that was absolutely ridiculous for my parents to be like, "No." You know what I mean? Well,

Fabian Geyrhalter:
You have to be open. I mean, you have to be open in chess.

Jahi Sundance:
And when I say ridiculous, I don't mean musically. I mean content politically ridiculous. Then they would probably step in and be like, "No." But to be an avant-garde jazz player, you got to be ready for your kids to like any kind of music and you got to be cool with that because that's what you want people to be cool with you. You know what I mean?

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Exactly. Well, in talking about avant-garde, and last night as I was knee-deep in prepping for my conversation with you, I stumbled upon a 2011 release titled Lakes at the Stone, which is a stunning life set of you playing a show with your dad. It is so remarkable. I mean, I didn't listen to the entire thing, and I will now over the coming weekend.
And I can't wait to really sit down and go into this. But what I was wondering, because I listened to the first 30 seconds of the first track, and I'm like, "Okay, well, it's like Jahi is kind of taking it easy on his dad." And then one minute in, it's like, "Nope, not so much."

Jahi Sundance:
Yeah, that's just how it starts.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Who did this collaboration challenge or creatively push outside of the comfort zone more? Was it you or your dad or neither?

Jahi Sundance:
I think my dad at that point was more used to doing these kind of shows where there'd be no rehearsal. I don't want to say no preparation because obviously you prepare in other ways, but no rehearsal and just going. And I think he was more used to it than me. So I think it definitely challenged me a lot because I had to, at that moment also, technology wasn't in the same place it is now.

Speaker 1:
Yeah.

Jahi Sundance:
So it was more challenging. As this has gone on, it's become so much easier with the stem separators and all the other things that are in the software. But when this first started, this was me with a fold up dolly and two crates of records and gear, all kinds of gear I would have to have to make this work when I first started DJing like this in 04, 05. And so that 2011 show is similar. I was using some serato, but a lot of vinyl, and the challenge was really keeping up when you have a limited amount of vinyl and you don't have instrumentals and acapellas of every single song like you do now.That Jolene thing is only possible because of STEM separation. If stem separation wasn't here, I wouldn't be able to do that Jolene

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Thing. Yeah. Or it would've been an insane amount of work to get it even close to that.

Jahi Sundance:
I would've had to make my own phase acapella and all that kind of stuff. That stuff's really hard to do. So that concert was definitely challenging and interesting because I had to keep up with my dad, which is always going to be hard because he was a master. That's a difficult task.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Yeah. Well, you are too now. But it's great because it doesn't feel effortless. Yeah, there's no friction, but you feel like two people pretending they're effortlessly at work, but things keep coming in and out and you know that someone is hopping onto the next thing. It's really cool. It was just really, really exciting. Oh,

Jahi Sundance:
Thank you, man. It's definitely very experimental, and I've had some people going online to check me out and somehow end up on that album first, and I'm like, "Oh no, that's not where you want to be. That's not the first listen. That's not the first list.That's not where you want to be first for most

Fabian Geyrhalter:
I did not start there. I did not start there. That came on my deep dive.

Jahi Sundance:
Yeah. For most people, that's not a great first place to start because it's just an alternative presentation of the music. So for a lot of people, they're not ready for that, but it is amazing record. I'm so glad I got to do it.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Amazing memory. An amazing memory just to do that. Totally. So let's talk about your collection. What's the size about? 8,000, 10,000, roughly?

Jahi Sundance:
I mean, I was saying 10,000 before, but I really want to say 8,000 just to be safe. It's about 8,000 records. I started collecting records when I started DJing, which is when I was 13 years old. And so I've been collecting records since then. So over 30 years I've been collecting records. The reason my collection got large because I ended up collecting and picking up a few other entire collections along the way.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Oh, nice.

Jahi Sundance:
Yeah. And one of them was a really precious one, and so I'm really grateful for that. And that was about 3,000 records, and I picked up another 2,000, and probably the other 3,000 I've procured myself.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Did you ever pause? Was it ever during the CD era or the MP3 era, or did you always keep digging?

Jahi Sundance:
I mean, I always get records every year. Obviously, when the equipment inside of the club started switching over, I switched over. It was a real relief not to carry three crates to a gig. I still love playing records and I love playing vinyl parties, and I'm still down to do it, but the every night three crates to the gig business, that was backbreaking.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
And this, my friend, is exactly why we create crates that actually come on wheels. We're like, "There's got to be a better way. You got to be able to - Yeah,

Jahi Sundance:
But then the crate would come on wheels, but then you get to the club and the DJ booth is up a spiral staircase.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Well, at some point, you got to get your workout in. At that point, Jahi, the way that our crates work is that the records don't fall onto your hands when you actually move the crate. And that's kind of nice because our handles are outside because I'm like," It's so dumb that the handles are... They're just two holes. And of course, you've got 50 records falling onto your fingers as a reward for you carrying that stuff. It's like, that's not nice.

Jahi Sundance:
Absolutely. Absolutely. So collecting-wise, it's always something that I've been doing. And I'm always traveling and going to countries and trying to hit up a few little record stores here and there and get some stuff to bring home.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Do you have a favorite record shop anywhere in the world? Is there one that you just absolutely love?

Jahi Sundance:
Yeah, at times there was record stores that I would always go to, but to be honest, the best times that I've had at record stores have been record stores that don't even exist anymore or didn't exist for a long time or record stores in the third world, which are really being run out of people's living rooms and stuff like that. Those were the spots that I really, really, really used to dig the most. You know what I mean?

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Yeah. Going into the basements or doing... It's not the commercial, it's not the tower records of the

Jahi Sundance:
World. Yeah, no, I went to a place, I went digging in Cuba two years ago, and that was just... None of the stores are record stores. You are going in someone's house and just going through their collection and picking out what you want.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Amazing. Unbelievable. Did you take a good amount back?

Jahi Sundance:
Yeah, I took about a crate home last time I was there, about a crate, so about 75 records I brought.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
What did you do? Did you ship it?

Jahi Sundance:
No, shipping it from Cuba is really hard, so you just had to buy a record bag while I was down there. They had a store that was selling some DJ equipment and record bags and stuff, so I just bought a record bag and just fly home with it.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
It's the constant struggle as vinyl collectors because traveling is the most fun. It's amazing.

Jahi Sundance:
Traveling

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Buying records is not the most fun because you got to be... Now you got a hundred pounds of records.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
It's the hunt that's fun. Once you actually acquired them, you're in deep shit. I remember this summer I was supposed to fly to the Faroe Islands with my wife because just for whatever reason, we were attracted and we wanted to go there. It didn't pan out, but the first thing I researched about the islands is, is there a record shop? And there are, I think two record shops, an entire island, and one of them is the main one, and it's opened every Tuesday from 12 to three o'clock. And that's it. And I'm like, "Oh my God, this is so cool. This is my life journey now. That's where I got to be." That's

Jahi Sundance:
Exactly where you want to

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Be. But you spending your life sampling, DJing, producing, when you're going through records in the basement or in Cuba, do you look at records as a split personality? There's the one personality that's the person who just listens and appreciates music and memories and maybe records that your dad was spinning early on, you want to rebuy it or is part of your brain is always hunting just for the next sample, for the next scratch, for something that you've never heard and never seen? How does it work with someone like you when you actually look for records?

Jahi Sundance:
I actually think that's where my collection is at now. There's obviously a few records in my mind that I still really want to have that are classics or whatever, but most of the stuff for the past 10 years, the stuff I'm looking for is to find new sounds, new voices, new words, new clips, new stuff I can use on stage and in my producing. So I've kind of drifted away from just like, "Oh, I need this German pressing of Stevie Wonder songs in the key of life." That's not really where my collection goes. My collection doesn't really go to a place of, "Oh, I have every version of Rick James 12 inch. I have the one with the blue cover and the one with the green cover." That's not really the direction of my collection. So my collection is really, especially the past 10 years, is really determined by the stage show and producing. And I really angle all of my purchases now towards that and I don't really have a collection where I'm trying to finish. I'm trying to get every David Bowie 12 inch. That's definitely not my goal with my records. And I'm not saying anything against those people because I love going to those people house.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
You better not talk against those people because there's literally every single person listening.

Jahi Sundance:
Please let me come to your house. Please, please, please. Because you go to somebody's crib and they have every prince 12 inch and your eyes pop out of your head. It's amazing. I love it. It's

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Beautiful. That's beautiful.

Jahi Sundance:
It's just not the purpose of my collection.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Is there an artist though that pops out where you're like you must probably have most records by a certain artist, even if you're not looking necessarily just for their records? Is there someone where you know...

Jahi Sundance:
I'll tell you who early on that was for me was D'Angelo. There was a bunch of weird D'Angelo vinyl that came out in the early 2000s. Right around Voodoo, there was the two live albums, they were really hard to get for a while. There was two live albums and then there was an instrumental promo only of the first album. There was a lot of cool D'Angelo stuff and I was running around New York City trying to find all that shit. There was bootlegs, there was remixes, there was all kinds of stuff. And so I was into that for a while and I kind of found all that stuff. And then the other stuff I was getting into, because I was from Jersey, was trying to find the original 12 inches of a lot of Jersey house. I don't know if you know, but this Jersey house stuff that was coming out in the late '90s, early 2000s, you could only get it on bootleg vinyl.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
This is fascinating. You know who told me this? It was an Uber driver somewhere in Kentucky.

Jahi Sundance:
Okay, that makes sense...

Fabian Geyrhalter:
He's originally from Jersey and I came in with this huge bag of records because even though I was traveling on client's expense, I still found the time in my afternoon to go record chosen. Go

Jahi Sundance:
Spend your own money. Yeah.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Oh, totally. And he's like, "Hey, what's that records?" And he's like, "Oh, I got memories of records back in Jersey." And I'm like, "What?" I mean, this is it. This is exactly it. How exciting.

Jahi Sundance:
Yeah. So basically there were all these illegal presses because all the songs that got released didn't get pressed up or didn't get pressed up massively. And so people would make these bootleg 12 inches that would have two or three songs on each side that would be songs you wanted to play, songs you had to play in the club if you were playing in Jersey for sure. And so for a while I also focused on trying to find the original pressings of a lot of those 12 inches, which was really hard to do because these records in a lot of cases were unknown, made by people who were unknown and then pressed up 200 copies and then got popular and there was no way to track these records down. There's no way.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Yeah, and you can't even sell them. I mean, that's the thing with online now. You can pretty much get anything and it kind of takes a little bit of the collecting excitement out of you because you could just click on anything and you have it in the mail a couple days later. But that's the kind of stuff. I don't want that. I'm a completist with one band in my life and I could buy all that shit. Of course I could, but there's no satisfaction in that. I want to be somewhere in England in a weird shop going downstairs and finding something I've been looking for for 10 years. That's what I want. Absolutely. So I mean those days were... I mean, it's cool and especially since someone just bootlegged it for a certain period of time because the club had to have it.

Jahi Sundance:
Yeah. And these bootlegs are so special because all the labels were made by... So also collecting the bootlegs too, those I think are super important records. Those bootlegs that we all were using because there were certain... I mean, believe it or not, there was even certain ridiculously popular rap singles that never came out on vinyl and they had to come out on bootleg and you could only get them on bootleg.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Why was that?

Jahi Sundance:
It would all depend on whatever was going on at the label for that cycle. Had they spent all their money? Did this record come out? And then certain stuff wouldn't be popular on the radio. It would only be popular with the DJs. This was during that time when things were really separated. There was no social media, so you couldn't really see what everybody else was doing. And certain DJs would run certain records and would grow like a crazy popularity in New York and you would need to play them. And there was no other mediums. It's all this moment pre-Serato, pre-computer, and you would have to have... But it was post-vinyl. So what would happen is some of these rap singles would only come on CD.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
It's such a fascinating time, right?

Jahi Sundance:
And so the bootleggers would bootleg it from the CD onto the vinyl.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Of course.

Jahi Sundance:
Because clubs didn't have CD players because the CDJ didn't exist. So the people were playing on those denon... I think Denon was the first one to have a club playable CD machine or it was somebody that's not really in the forefront now, you know what I mean? One of those companies.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Anyway. Back in that day, I remember the excitement when I was a teenager and when I was growing up and when I was traveling to different places and I went to the clubs there or to the discos, and you just heard these bangers that you never heard before, and you went back home and it's like a neighboring country and it just doesn't exist. And you were the cool kid on the block because you brought it back and you're like, listen to that. And that was just so cool. I mean, especially as a DJ, it's like X10, but even as a consumer of music, it was just such an exciting time where people did not know everything and they couldn't just go everywhere. And you couldn't just find everything.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Exactly.

Jahi Sundance:
It was regional. It was regional. It was local. There was people pressing up a thousand copies of a record never to get pressed again. You know what I mean? It was local, it was interesting. And that stuff, I think all that stuff is going to start coming back. 

Jahi Sundance:
I think we've kind of hit our limit on everything being available all the time. And I think people are starting to realize that it's cool on your phone and you can have it, but it's better to have a special experience with something than it is to have a casual experience with everything.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Exactly. I totally, 100% agree. Talking about special experiences, can you think of a record that you cherish the most? One that you have where you're like, it's to go to, it's the

Jahi Sundance:
One. Well, there's records that I cherish, but I really want to talk about a record that shocks everybody. Let's go for it. I'd rather talk about that. There's a record, I keep it in my studio in LA, and when I'm having sessions with people and I'm working with them, let's say I'm working with somebody for a few days, it's almost inevitable that I'll bring this record up to show them to play it for them because it's so shocking. People don't know about it. So Luis Farrakhan has a couple of records, and a lot of people don't know about Farrakhan's musical career. He was a concert violinist when he was 12 or 10 and was playing with orchestras and shit all over the country. They were traveling him around as a little kid violin prodigy that you would go see because he's a little kid. You know what I mean?

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Yeah, of course. Yeah.

Jahi Sundance:
Playing all this crazy violin music.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Amazing.

Jahi Sundance:
After that chapter, he got with some record producers and made a full on funky Roy Ayers type album that people don't really know about. And the song on there is called Heed the Call, y'all, and it's got this violin introduction followed by this super funky claw groove with base and so funky. I mean, it literally is like a Roy Ayers song, and I play it for people, and I always start it from the middle and I don't show them the cover and they have to guess who it is. And nobody's ever got it. Nobody's ever got it. Nobody ever says that's Luis Farrakhan.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
How did you find this or where?

Jahi Sundance:
Nobody's got it. Oh, I got it in Brooklyn at a fair in the park type of situation. But this record is known. I've definitely pulled it out in front of some other DJs, Pals, and they have been like, "Oh yeah, I have that. I have a copy of that.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Oh, cool.

Jahi Sundance:
There's a few of the other, obviously the DJ guys, but when I'm working with musicians and stuff in the studio, they've never heard of it and they get so excited about it.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
What a riot.

Jahi Sundance:
Yeah, it's such a cool record to have.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Got to check it out.

Jahi Sundance:
I really, really, really, really love it. Yep, it's killing. It's got the long violin intro of him playing violin for five or six minutes of just him playing solo violin, the classical...

Fabian Geyrhalter:
And then it drops.

Jahi Sundance:
And then, yeah, super funky. The groove is crazy. And then all the lyrics are super educational about black people coming to America on the slave ships and the whitey. It's amazing.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
So like a sample heaven for you, I'm sure. 

Jahi Sundance:
Oh, it definitely is. I'm surprised that record hasn't turned up sampled yet, or at least I haven't heard it yet. We're at a point now where there's a lot of music, but I was surprised it didn't turn up sampled in that heavy period in the late '90s. I'm surprised it didn't get sampled by Tribe or Big Daddy Kane or somebody during that classic era.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Well, I think you should bring it to your gigs in New York. There we go. The challenge. The challenge is on. All right, let's go to the more difficult question here. Top five albums, no particular order.

Jahi Sundance:
Oh, no

Fabian Geyrhalter:
I know.

Jahi Sundance:
Top five Albums. Oh, God.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
So I asked you in the beginning, I'm like, "Hey, did you get some of those questions that I like to ask?" It's no problem. No problem.

Jahi Sundance:
All right, let's go -

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Off the hip, off the hip.

Jahi Sundance:
OutKast's ATLiens, probably one of the most important rap songs in my life. Rap albums in my life was the second Outkast album. It made a big difference to me in my life. It really changed me. It influenced me at a time that was really important. I'm going to go with next, let's say... I mean, It's Got to Be There because It's Got to Be There. Songs in the Key of Life.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
I could see that coming. I don't know why, but I could see it coming.

Jahi Sundance:
We don't really have a choice, do we? You know what I'm Saying?

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Did you know that last night, Stevie Wonder dropped an EP of four songs? You saw that, yeah. And they're good. They're really good.

Jahi Sundance: 

Of course. Well, of course. Yeah. Are you kidding me? 

Fabnian Geyrhalter:

Yeah, of course you know. It's like, oh my God.

Jahi Sundance:
None of my friends missed that. We were all ...that was on every group chat that I'm in. There was no skips. That was every group chat. So I'm going to go with 36 Chambers, number three. Number four, I'm going to go with Bitter, Meshell. And number five, Out to Lunch, Eric Dolphy.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Fantastic. You got it down to five. What I always do on this show, I always have a playlist where I basically just pick songs from all the artists too. You mentioned them from all the records. So this is going to be a real fun playlist. I'm looking forward to that. It's going to be weird. And there's not one that's not weird, I promise you that, especially when it comes to what was the first record? And people are like, "Well, it must be Modern Talking." It's like, "Oh, you don't know I'm making a playlist, do you know?"

Jahi Sundance:
No. I have no Clue.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
What's a recent release in the last... Well, don't say Stevie Wonder EP, but what's a recent release that you're super excited about or that you listen to a lot?

Jahi Sundance:
Oh, man. Did you listen to Willow's album from two years ago?

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Yes. Yes.

Jahi Sundance:
Oh my God. We love you, Willow. You smacked it. You smacked it, girl. Also, Meshell put out what I will boldly say is the best, not singular, but you have to take this sentence exactly. The best album of covers ever created, Ventriloquism is the best -

Fabian Geyrhalter:
I didn't know it's out yet. I listened to two or three of the songs.

Jahi Sundance:
No, you're talking about the Duets album. That's brand New.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Oh, okay. Okay.

Jahi Sundance:
I'm talking about Ventriloquism, which came out three or four years ago. This is an album of covers of Just Meshell. The Duets album is also all covers, but it's all duets. This is Just Meshell. It's called Ventriloquism. Listen to this album, bro.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Think I missed it. This is amazing.

Jahi Sundance:
It is unbelievably good.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
And this is why I love doing this show so much, because everyone listening, including myself, we're just going to rush out and find new records and find...

Jahi Sundance:
I mean, there's always music. That's what's exciting about music is it never runs out. There's always somebody you never heard of. That's literally amazing.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
It's so beautiful.

Jahi Sundance:
Almost always. It's crazy how it is, but it's true. It's true. It's really true. And then I'm also going to go with the last NxWorries album, the last Anderson.Paak Knxwledge album. Did you listen to that one?

Fabian Geyrhalter:
I did.

Jahi Sundance:
Banger.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
I did. Yeah.

Jahi Sundance:
Absolute banger. And I'm into all the Griselda guys. They're all my favorites. So Westside Gunn, fucking Benny the Butcher, fucking Conway. I love them. I love them.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
You're working on the playlist, my friend. I like it. Sounding good. Sounding good. You are going to drop your second album soon, right?

Jahi Sundance:
Yeah. My second record is actually finished and I should put it out soon, but I've just been getting together some stuff with another project that I'm working on, kind of ate my budget for my album that I had to prioritize this other project first. So I think I'll get my album out soon enough. The second album is called Every Love Story is a Tragedy.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
How optimistic of you?

Jahi Sundance:
It goes with the first album, Love Isn't Enough. It's going to be a triptych of just sad love records. That's doing, doing three of those.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
What I'm even though for those listening, you got to check out the first record. It also features Rob on there - Meshell's on that too.

Jahi Sundance:
Yeah.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Yeah, exactly. And it is absolutely not depressing. It's not the love record that you think it is.

Jahi Sundance:
I always describe it to people as if you like uptempo songs about being depressed, it's a good record for you.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Oh yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. 

Jahi Sundance:
Songs have energy. They're not sad sounding, but the lyrics are -

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Until you listen to the lyrics. Yes.

Jahi Sundance:
The lyrics are definitely like, "Oh, what happened?"

Fabian Geyrhalter:
But isn't it funny? There are so many huge pop hits that are so wrong when you listen to the lyrics. They're just crazy stuff. Most of them are about drugs and sex and all kinds of things and everyone just sings it at the gas station and once you actually listen to the lyrics.

Jahi Sundance:
My favorite theory is that Kiss from a Rose is about cocaine.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
I did not know that, but then again, when you say Kiss of a... Yeah, I know. I'm honest, man. I'm transparent here.

Jahi Sundance:
I'm going to say some of the lyrics to you so you could just get it in your brain.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
So I can bleep them out.

Jahi Sundance:
But did you know that when it snows, my eyes become large and the light that you shine can be huge?

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Oh, come On. Come On.

Jahi Sundance:
To me, you're like a growing addiction that I can't deny. Won't you tell me is it healthy? This dude, did you know that when it snows, my eyes become large?

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Oh my God. And then the cover was perfect, perfect too, in lots and lots of white with completely butt naked.

Jahi Sundance:
The more I get of you, the stranger it feels. Now that your rose is in bloom, the light hits the gloom on the grave.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Oh my God. And then there's this... And I can't think of it for the life of me now. There's the big police hit that is played at every wedding and it's basically about a stalker, but everyone thinks that…

Jahi Sundance:

Every breath you take. 

Fabnian Geyrhalter:

That's it! It's like the creepiest freaking song ever, right? And it's like, "Oh, let's all get married here." It's fantastic.

Jahi Sundance:
Don't you see you belong to me and how my poor heartaches for every breath you take, but he's standing across the street. It's terrible.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Oh, man. I think this is the perfect note to finish our interview on. Awesome. It's depressive. It's dark. It's great. It's a good intro to your next record. So you're up to two different projects right now. You're touring. Obviously, we already talked about that. So you and Robert Glasper, the band's going to be touring for the rest of the year, it sounds like. Anything else exciting coming up that people should know about?

Jahi Sundance:
I'm producing a documentary about my dad's life. It's called Spirit Spirit: The Music of Oliver Lake, and that should be out by the middle of 27. So hopefully by the summer of 27, we'll have that summer next year.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
How special. Amazing.

Jahi Sundance:
And also, I can't really talk about it on this pod, but -

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Oh yes, you can.

Jahi Sundance:
Look out for my next project, which is going to be a new record label, and we should be up and running with that hopefully by January.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
So cool.

Jahi Sundance:
And that's what's going on Between the - The Label, the Studio, the touring, and also just producing records normally for other people, just normal producing. Man, I'm trying to do... I always tell people I do all the music jobs, as many of them as I can.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Just living a dull and boring life.

Jahi Sundance:
Yeah. Super, super, super boring, man. Just clock in to work at 9:00. I clock out at 5:00.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
And that's it. And then having the drink and that's it.

Jahi Sundance:
Work that factory. Yeah. Well, man, it's been great. Thank you so much for having me, and I really appreciate it, bro.

Fabian Geyrhalter:
Absolutely. This was awesome. Thank you so much for your time.